New 4-way stop causes train of traffic

Thursday, August 5, 2010
Shortly after 3 p.m. Wednesday, traffic was backed up at least 30 cars deep on westbound State Road 240 at its intersection with Zinc Mill Road and Percy Julian Drive. The four-way stop went into effect Wednesday morning. Local motorists fear the problem will continue and even get worse during shift changes at Walmart Distribution and Heartland Automotive, as well as the beginning and end of the school day at Greencastle schools.

INDOT workers Gary Cross and Joseph Dark put the finishing touches on a stop line at State Road 240 and Percy Julian Drive and Zinc Mill Road late Wednesday morning. Highway crews spent much of the day installing signs and rumble strips, as well as painting new traffic lines.
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  • Was this a surprise? I guess their study wasn't on the road when they done it. Must have been bird watching that day.

    -- Posted by indy500 on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 12:48 AM
  • Well I am glad to see they created a 6 way stop instead of a four that helped. They didn't close the turn lanes. At 10:30 last night it was backed up some but not like in the afternoon. Looks like they didn't need to put the bumps in the road to warn you about the stop, because you can't go fast enough over them now. What is the purpose of this highway now? Its a simulation of traffic in Indy. I guess if you are board and want to waste time and gas take Veterans HIGHWAY! What a joke. Redo the study with the stop signs. Because someone can't count when they are driving 45 mph I guess. Try counting at dead stops.....

    -- Posted by hellogreencastle on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 1:00 AM

    This is the worst idea ever thought of.

    It will only get worse. I will stop using the Southern Highway.

    This 4 way stop makes as much sense as putting a 4 way stop on the Interstate.

    I hope the people that came up with this idea are proud of themselves.

    -- Posted by Old Man on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 1:49 AM
  • Well, is anyone REALLY surprised by this?

    Famous saying:

    If it ain't broke


    -- Posted by Mercidos on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 4:21 AM
  • Well, so much for driving through Greencastle (east and west anyway).

    Indiana can start a new list,,, "10 Worst Towns to Drive In"!

    -- Posted by Xgamer on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 4:56 AM
  • My mother was nearly killed there yesterday. She was headed west and stopped when a man in a truck passed her, at 40 miles per hour, on the left in the turn lane. All the while honking at HER! This is NOT a good idea and if the educated idiots who came up with this would have ask John Doe public who actually uses this road would have soon discovered what a disater this would be. I've advised my mother NOT to take this route until people are used to the stop.

    -- Posted by theworldwelivein on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 6:34 AM
  • Can someone tell me why this is considered a "highway"? I mean, it is what, 3 miles long, 40 mph speed limit, and now a stop sign. It really needs to be renamed to "Veterans Memorial Road".

    Can't wait to see what traffic looks like once school is in session!!!! Just take a good long look at that picture above and then imagine the line being 2-3 times longer! Ah the pleasure of driving in Greencastle!

    The town needs to just cut it's losses and remove the stop signs now. I know it would stink to remove them so soon after installing them, but it would not be unprecedented. I believe we all would have more respect for the town to go ahead and remove them, rather than to leave them simply out of pride and stubbornness. OBVIOUSLY, the stop signs MUST go!!!

    -- Posted by vela on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 6:52 AM
  • OK the jokes over now let's get a stoplight!

    -- Posted by Trying hard on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 6:56 AM
  • After years of working with traffic management the key is to keep traffic moving and flowing. When I first heard this I knew it would not work. I'm not sure why they decided to do this. A round about, stop light, or nothing at all is the only solution.

    -- Posted by nascar_Couple on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 7:13 AM
  • I have a family member who works at Heartland. He got off work with everyone else. The veterans highway was backed up past their road. He went south to the airport road out at Martinsville St. and 231. He lives near campus. His neighbor (2 houses down) went out onto veterans highway to 231. My family member was home 25 minutes before his neighbor and they left work at the same time. Just remember the only school in session right now is IVY Tech. There will be more traffic at the 3 o'clock hour in just 1 week. Is this really a fix to the problem or a new problem?

    -- Posted by whatruthinking2 on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 7:17 AM
  • Simply put INDOT is full of idiots! We wanted a light...we need a light! Their study was actually done in the last year they have updated info. They feel there is not enough traffic to warrat a light and as the city kept complaining they opted to give a 4-way to shut the city up and now we have a mess. If this was a city road we could do what we wanted. Sadly its State Road 240 so when the bad accidents occur sue the heck out of the State. Warn your teens not to drive that intersection its to dangerous!

    -- Posted by hardtobelieve on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 7:48 AM
  • This is the dumbest idea ever seriously. its going to do nothing but cause a huge problem when Greencastle schools are in session and even now. i was driving in town yesterday and turned left there by H.O.P. and the school. trying to turn there is terrible because you cant see anything coming across the road if there is a car right beside you thats stopped. this is going to be dangerous for upcoming new drivers who are not quite experienced. a light would be so much better and safer for the road. with the stop sign were going to end up having a lot more wrecks, especially when school is back in session. not to mention the traffic will be backed up 3 times longer. i'm going to avoid using this road as much as possible even though its wasting gas and time to just get around it. and with this economy its a shame for people to have to do that but thats what happens when people come up with stupid ideas such as stop signs in the middle of what was called a highway.

    -- Posted by whatshappeningtothistown on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 8:01 AM
  • WOW! What great use of the English language, using "to" for "too,""board" for "bored," etc. Folks, if you want to make an impression, you should use the write form of the word. :) LOL

    P.S. 4 Way stops are meant to stop traffic. Not a good idea on a "bypass," which is intended to speed up traffic. Good luck getting it fixed.

    -- Posted by cvilleguy on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 8:48 AM
  • It would be nice if INDOT would come down and witness the chaos of trafic that is going to happen 8-12-10 when school is back in session. INDOT has to understand that they have a bigger problem then what they think. Any idiot knows this is not the solution. But we are not dealing with your everday idiot, it's INDOT. What schmucks!!!!

    -- Posted by NotreDameFan01 on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 8:55 AM
  • Time is money. The Walmart trucks will no longer use the 240 highway "bypass" because it costs the company money to sit and wait at a stop sign on a limited access highway. More trucks on Greencastle city streets thru town will be Walmart's answer.

    Will common sense ever be used by those (INDOT and Greencastle officials) that "know better than us common folks."

    -- Posted by Lookout on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 9:04 AM
  • WOW! What great use of the English language, using "to" for "too,""board" for "bored," etc. Folks, if you want to make an impression, you should use the write form of the word. :) LOL

    Good one cvilleguy. Now maybe YOU should use the RIGHT form of the word!

    It's money folks. $100,000.00 to install a light.$150,000.00 for maintenance, repair, upgrades, and power usage over 10 years.

    -- Posted by exhoosier2 on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 9:19 AM
  • "write form"?

    -- Posted by smrtrthnu on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 9:42 AM
  • Sure, they have bad grammar. Good for you to spot it.

    Now, let's get a **** roundabout in there. The stop signs are clearly a clusterf*** and they know it now.

    -- Posted by Mercidos on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 9:42 AM
  • The new stop signs did not stop the person from running it yesterday and almost hitting me! I don't care how much it cost to put in a light, it needs to be done. Lives are worth a lot more than any amount of money!

    -- Posted by RDALERESIDENT on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 9:43 AM
  • RIDICULOUS!! First of all, they've now installed something like a 7-way stop instead of 4 since they've stupidly added turning lanes! Then, I've asked the same thing. WHY is this actually called a 'highway'?? It is absolutely not treated like any such thing. And yes, traffic is bad all over the town at 3:00 but right there?? It's awful and anyone doing any type of study would have known that! It will get to the point that we are all trying to avoid that area. I know I'm looking for an alternate route already. Wish we had another 'bypass' in the city but then, somehow that would get all screwed up too!!

    -- Posted by bannerstuff on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 9:51 AM
  • A light would be tremendous. In the meantime there has to be something. The children that have to cross that street every day need to be able to do so safely.

    -- Posted by So... on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 9:58 AM

    What is dangerous are the idiot drivers who are to impatient to wait their turn to get into or out of the flow of traffic. Not to mention the distracted drivers, such as the cellphone using one that caused the semi accident there a few weeks ago. Get rid of the cell phone, slow down and take your time.

    Don't know how many distracted drivers I have seen along that road on a daily basis.

    A 6 WAY STOP SIGN NOR A TRAFFIC LIGHT IS NOT NEEDED HERE!!!!!, nor anywhere else along that stretch of road.

    Anyone want to wager how long it will be before the firt rear end collision happens here. I give it 5 days.

    -- Posted by mchunter on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 10:41 AM
  • Well duh! I wonder how much money INDOT made from this screw up.

    -- Posted by TinaB on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 10:44 AM
  • This is in response to mchunter, the girl that was in the accident with the semi was NOT on her cell phone, not sure where your info came from!!

    -- Posted by daoclo on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 11:09 AM
  • This is just crazy! Someone is going to get killed here! I can't wait until school starts to see what the line is like. Fun times for students and staff at Greencastle schools let me tell ya!

    -- Posted by me me on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 11:10 AM
  • I am happy to see that something has been done to a very dangerous intersection! The person who GOT hit by that semi is a good friend of mine who has no choice but to use that intersection, and like many people have already stated, it is very difficult to see when you are stopped and another car is next to you! Do not judge someone because of an ACCIDENT, you should be thankful it was not one of your loved ones. I am thankful she survived and is slowly getting better. Where is compassion for people, all I have read is "people will now have to wait, people will be late, blah, blah, blah," leave for work, or school earlier, quit rushing around and blaming others, driving is serious and I am tired of seeing people speeding through the school zone!

    -- Posted by FedUp tax payer on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 11:18 AM
  • It does not help that the city is also fixing major roads and putting in curbs and sewer drains. It does take some creativity to get around town now. As for the four way stop, I agree that it should have never been put there. I understand that the girl who was hit this summer could not see, but she could have waited until the car beside her had left.The city and INDOT need to take some time and really look into the issue. Also, please, look at all of the other road repair that is going on and see that it also caused this mess.

    -- Posted by mimmi1234 on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 11:42 AM
  • This is stupid. Was there really that big of a problem before the stop signs?

    -- Posted by floyd'srangerriders on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 12:05 PM
  • And, nobody going to the Wal-Mart Supersstore...L0L

    -- Posted by do-read on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 12:08 PM
  • I never saw anything on a meeting to discuss the possibility of a 4-way on the BYPASS? INDOT threw the city a sarcastic bone and the Einsteins' jumped on it before thinking. It doesn't take rocket science to know what would happen, so why didn't the city say no until it could be done right?, I know it doesn't solve the problem but it doesn't compound it either. And to think that the one that had the best vise to get something done right is now a representative.

    -- Posted by sadNmad on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 12:32 PM
  • yes, something needed to be be done, and as for mimmi1234's comment, if she did wait and the car next to her got hit, what would happen then? It looks like a lot of people are mad because they will have to use a little common sense, to bad for you, good for us that are wanting to be safe. I see this as a wake up call, and I will leave a few minutes earlier, will be PATIENTLY waiting in line to stop, with a smile on my face :)

    -- Posted by FedUp tax payer on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 12:37 PM
  • The only way to get your voice heard is to

    A: Write a letter to INDOT


    B: Go to a Town Council Meeting and voice your opinion

    Stop hiding behind your usernames if you're so upset and do something about it the right way.

    -- Posted by climberguy on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 12:56 PM
  • A roundabout? Are you serious? A fairly large percentage of the motoring public here have problems navigating a simple four way stop. A roundabout would be bumpercar chaos. Plus add in the semi trucks that need to take up two lanes when making a turn, think about that.

    I know, maybe we could get the folks that were trying to do traffic control for the fair to also work this intersection during the busy times of the day. That way they could stop and back traffic up on highway 240 for ten minutes at a time much like they did on highway 231 while they tried to empty the fairgrounds everynight. Traffic backed up for a half mile or so is always good for a rear ender or two.

    -- Posted by Registered Voter on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 1:37 PM
  • The factories need to stagger their shifts just a bit. That would certainly help.

    -- Posted by localman on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 2:05 PM
  • Yes, localman, I agree with you about the need to stagger the shifts. But, since it has not been ever done, I would have to think that the factories have vetoed that idea. Even before the 4 way stop, it was very hard to travel in Greencastle. Has anyone been at the light at Walmart when the factories let out? It can take two to three light changes before you can get out.

    -- Posted by mimmi1234 on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 2:39 PM
  • WOW this just goes to show how stupid this idea was! I agree how can we call this a highway with a stop sign right in the middle. I will drive other ways if I have to get to Wal-Mart or any other place down that way. You don't have to use that road to get places, and I would much rather go another way than to sit in traffic for half an hour or longer. It's awesome that we can waste tax dollars to put a four way stop in the middle of a highway but can't get the roads fixed that have needed it for awhile now.

    -- Posted by nefarious on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 2:42 PM
  • smrtrthnu: I'm sure exhoosier2 was being sarcastic.

    -- Posted by Dagnabbitt on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 2:47 PM
  • The highway was supposed to take traffic off Indianapolis Road. Now the traffic will be back on Indianapolis Road. And don't blame INDOT. The Greencastle Mayor and her group wanted this. Blame them.

    -- Posted by not gullible on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 4:29 PM
  • How about the great people of Greencastle having a fund raiser, we could see who we could get to put on a great show and charge a bunch of money to see it , raffle off some goodies and buy the stoplight ourselves, then donate it to the city and let them pay the upkeep?? WIN WIN

    -- Posted by gadgetguy on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 4:56 PM
  • Climberguy is that your real name? lol

    -- Posted by justme44 on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 5:51 PM
  • Mrs. Murray, tear down this sign!

    -- Posted by elbarto on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 6:19 PM
  • While I don't travel that road on a regular basis, I never really saw the reason to add ANYTHING to that intersection, except maybe some increased enforcement of the 25 mph speed limit during the opening and dismissing of school. Seeing that picture in the Banner Graphic, I really think it's a MAJOR accident just waiting to happen! I WILL NOT be traveling on that road until the stop signs come down!

    -- Posted by missp on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 7:07 PM
  • Well, it wasn't too bad today....

    -- Posted by localman on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 7:25 PM

    -- Posted by zeegron on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 8:49 PM
  • Here's the deal folks...There are several options for this intersection:

    1-Leave it be

    2-Stop Signs

    3-Stop Lights


    5-Yellow Flasher on VMH and Red Flasher on Percy Julian/Zinc Mill

    It does not matter what the city and/or INDOT decide, there is going to be a group of people that agree with, a group that disagrees with it and then those that just take it in stride. You can gripe all you want but it is INDOT that has the final say in wether a stoplight will ever be put up at that intersection and not the City of Greencastle.

    If you feel so strongly about this subject, you need to call and/or write the Mayor's Office, INDOT, Local and State Politicians. Maybe if they get enough grief from the public, they will do another study and rethink their decision.

    -- Posted by Palimino on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 10:48 PM
  • zeegron

    Surprise, Surprise...Once again it turns to someone bashing our local police.

    I suppose you don't ever take a break while you are working? Probably not.

    You'd probably need to have a job first.

    -- Posted by ProblemTransmission on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 10:57 PM
  • "Hi, I'm a PC, and I'm making the world a better place." Please, get out from in front of your computer screen and see what really works out here.

    -- Posted by beemerman on Thu, Aug 5, 2010, at 11:24 PM
  • Zeegron you stand out in the middle of that intersection and try to make people pay attention. I believe you'd make a nice speed bump!

    -- Posted by hardtobelieve on Fri, Aug 6, 2010, at 8:19 AM
  • Use a different route and stop complaining or write your officials a letter of complaint. Do you really think that they read this column? If their mail box was flodded with all of this mail perhaps something would be done. The best suggestion yet is the flashing light but better yet is a return to the way it was.

    -- Posted by dumpsterdiva2 on Fri, Aug 6, 2010, at 8:37 AM
  • Hey exhoosier2 .... I do believe you missed the joke.

    See how easy it is to get away from the real topic by using the wrong words?

    Thanks for reading and good luck local people with this one.

    -- Posted by cvilleguy on Fri, Aug 6, 2010, at 9:26 AM
  • UGH!

    I went to the turn lane to turn on Percy L. Jullian and it was my turn to turn... I got cut off and almost had a collision!!!!!!!!!!

    I am FURIUOUS!

    i no longer take vetrans it is a hot mess!

    -- Posted by BlackBarbie22 on Fri, Aug 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM
  • When all the furious, agigated people go out of their way to avoid this intersection and divert their traffic to other roads, INDOT will do another study and conclude that nothing needs to be done. They'll say the case is closed. Please, just give us a stoplight and adjust the timers for when traffic is heaviest. Is that so hard?

    -- Posted by Light in the Dark on Fri, Aug 6, 2010, at 12:27 PM
  • Avoiding the road will only show INDOT and the city that the stop signs are effective. Writing letters would be a better approach, and you can still avoid the road if you choose. I agree that the stop sign is ignorant and an accident waiting to happen!

    -- Posted by joyful heart on Fri, Aug 6, 2010, at 3:37 PM
  • Cops have the right to direct traffic if the situation needs it. Do they need the mayors approval to do that? They dont when its an accident or road construction. I wasnt really ******** about them other than they could step up and do something instead of visiting gas stations and talking all the time, I mean they are the ones telling us how to navigate through a 4 way stop in the other article. I see traffic cops standing in the middle of the street in new york city and chicago. If it was so dangerous then why can they do it in cities with millions of people but not in greencastle. I thought a police officers job was to serve the PUBLIC.

    -- Posted by zeegron on Sat, Aug 7, 2010, at 2:40 AM
  • A roundabout would cause many side-impact and nose-to-tail accidents; the woman who ran the stop sign there a few weeks ago hit the side of the truck so hard it was knocked into the ditch. I drove through there yesterday and watched 3 young teens walk across, was honked at by a driver who ran the new stop signs, passed another pedestrian who had just walked across the intersection. The traffic was mostly stopping correctly and was not longer than 2 or 3 cars stopped at a time. Change is often painful, but as a concerned parent who lives on Zinc Mill Road I have seen the People Pathways surveying team on that street and I saw an article in the Banner-Graphic just a few weeks ago that said,"Its a shame that someone has to get killed there before they will do something about it." We needed it.

    -- Posted by alfr1 on Sat, Aug 7, 2010, at 10:01 AM
  • Another Greencastle blunder!

    -- Posted by 1stamendrights on Sun, Aug 8, 2010, at 2:33 AM
  • hey Zeegron...why dont you take your welfare fattened hindparts out there and direct traffic...stop bashing folks that cannot do anything about the situation and contact INDOT or city hall with your complaint, or get off your lazy hiney and go stand at the corner with a sign. Get something done about the situation instead of bashing on here....fool

    -- Posted by dreadpirateroberts=idiot on Sun, Aug 8, 2010, at 7:22 PM
  • I'll tell you what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna take a different way to WalMart from now on. Yeah I'll show them, I won't drive on Veterans Highway anymore until they take down those signs.

    Good grief people, get a grip. Where is the "rolleyes" emoticon at.

    -- Posted by Registered Voter on Mon, Aug 9, 2010, at 2:19 AM
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