Pool revenues, expenses get city attention

Tuesday, November 13, 2018

Everything from the price of a candy bar at the concession stand to the cost of admission to the rate for renting the pool for a private party is under the microscope as city officials look for ways to narrow the gap between expenses and revenues at the Greencastle Aquatic Center.

Looking at a report that shows a $65,344 deficit between revenues and expenses at the city pool this year, the City Council listened to Park Director Rod Weinschenk’s ideas for closing that gap during the November Council meeting.

After working with City Clerk-Treasurer Lynda Dunbar and a Park Board subcommittee on the issue, Weinschenk told the Council, he’s “not prepared to say this is how much we’re going to charge for a candy bar but I can give you some points of discussion the Park Board will be talking about in the next month or two.”

There are several issues at play that have affected city pool attendance and operations in recent years.

First of all, the school calendar has forced shrinkage upon the swim season, which once routinely went from Memorial Day through Labor Day but now goes only Memorial Day through the first week of August. Staying open beyond that has become problematic because the lifeguards are high school students, mostly athletically involved high schoolers whose sports seasons will have started and will negate them working once school begins.

Another issue appears to be the “unintended consequence,” as Councilman Dave Murray put it, of the addition of the Bob York Splashpark. With that free-admission facility in full operation this year, the pool saw a decline in attendance of 4,000 visitors. Of course, that entire total cannot be attributed to the splashpark but it certainly appears to be more than a coincidence.

Weinschenk noted that prior to the splashpark opening, mom and dad might take a two-year-old to the pool, and while the toddler would be admitted free, mom and dad would pay $5 each and maybe a brother and sister older than five as well. So the family might pay $10 to $20 to come to the pool, now they are all going to the splash park to cool off for free.

Also likely affecting city pool attendance is the availability of other options in the area, such as the indoor facility at Plainfield or the new lazy river set-up at Lebanon.

And then again, the pool may just not be as cool as it once was.

“What I wish,” Weinschenk said, “I could do is take away the cellphones the kids have today. Only for the reason why ... 10 ... 20 ... 30 years ago the swimming pool was the place to go during the summer if Johnny wanted to be with his friends or Jane wanted to see her friends. But with the ability of the cellphone right now, they can talk, they can see them, they can be with their friends 24 hours a day at any time during the day if they like.”

While Weinschenk knows he can’t change society, he hopes to find a niche that might be more interesting than endlessly staring at a cellphone screen.

“We need to find that one thing that’s going to make the aquatic center the place to be again,” he told the City Council.

Somewhere down the road, he said, the pool could add new amenities that might draw more people and substantiate an increase in the $5 daily admission price.

“For example,” the park director said, “maybe another water slide, a drop slide. Maybe we could add a diving board.

“Right now, looking at our five-year master plan, what I’d like to see down the road would be a lazy river. But that’s $2 million as an estimate from Spear Corp.”

And while park officials have been in agreement on not wanting to increase the $5 daily admission fee, Weinschenk notes there is “some room for discussion in regard to pool passes, pool rentals and the special birthday parties you can have at the swimming pool. We want to look at the expenses those cost us and see if our revenues are in fact meeting those.”

At a recent Park Board meeting, Councilman Steve Fields suggested Weinschenk determine how much it costs per hour to operate the pool, considering all factors -- water, electricity, chemicals, employees, all overhead -- to set a better rate for pool party rentals. The prevailing notion of the Park Board is that the pool was essentially losing money or breaking even on pool rentals, when it should be making money with such an interesting amenity to offer.

The average daily cost of running the pool, Weinschenk said, is $1,439.99. Fields said that figure should be divided to determine a “for-profit rental” charge for pool rental beginning next summer.

City Council President Adam Cohen looked at another number, the $113,759 in pool operations expenses, and suggested the pool would need approximately 250 people per day through the door to operate the pool efficiently.

“If you’re operating it at a profit,” Weinschenk commented.

“I‘m just talking about breaking even,” Cohen responded.

“Realistically,” Mayor Bill Dory interjected, “we’re not going to break even.”

Cohen asked Weinschenk what the average daily attendance was this summer.

“About 100,” he said. “Last summer was about 100.”

So with expenses at the pool totaling $140,901 (including consessions costs) and revenues at $75,557 this summer, a $65,344 deficit was created, about twice what most city officials recall in the past.

“I just remember hearing in the past we were losing amounts like $30,000 or $35,000 a year,” said City Attorney Laurie Hardwick, who is serving in her third mayoral administration. “We’ve traditionally lost that.”

“That depends on what you mean by lost,” Weinschenk responded, “because traditionally it’s been subsidized by property tax dollars. This year I think it’s just a little larger.”

“My point is it’s double what I remember,” Hardwick added.

Weinschenk told the Council “these were all points of discussion we’ve come up with over the last month and a half because we want to release our spring brochure early with these prices in it, so the Park Board will be discussing it at our December meeting and probably again in January.”

Cohen assured Weinschenk that he is supportive of the pool and stressed that “the park is value added to our city.”

“The pool is a tax-supported service,” Weinschenk observed, agreeing it would never make a profit or likely even come close.

But that doesn’t mean it’s not a valuable commodity.

Clerk-Treasurer Dunbar said she’d like to see the pool “become a destination point because we get people in for a day but it would be nice to be able to bring families in for a whole day and have them stay and come downtown. So I think the pool eventually could become a really big destination point which could even help to revitalize that side of town.”

Cohen nodded in agreement.

“You don’t have to argue too much with me for a pool,” the DePauw University swim coach said. “And lazy rivers? All about ‘em.”

Mayor Dory closed the discussion by saying he and Weinschenk are open to suggestions.

“Personally I don’t believe it’s going to be one thing (to turn things around),” he said, “but a number of things over the next few years.”

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  • I think getting a new park director should be a consideration. The whole park appearance was the lowest this year that I have ever seen it. We need someone that truly cares!

    -- Posted by Falcon9 on Wed, Nov 14, 2018, at 8:25 AM
  • His solution is to add a diving board? You had a diving board that you ripped out because you were too lazy to maintain it. Also, lets add $2mil in expenses to that we MIGHT increase attendance!? Sounds like a great business strategy. And Yes ROD you LOST $65K, it may have been covered by property taxes but you STILL LOST IT.

    And the excuse of closing when school starts is just a cop out. I worked at the pool in the early 2000's and we had the exact same problems ("optional" training started in late July and 2-a-days started at the beginning of August) and yet we were still open until labor day.

    What is needed is new management at the parks department. Rod has repeatedly shown the inability to appropriately staff, maintain, and manage and keeps getting a pass. Must be nice to work in government because anyone in the private sector with his record would have been canned along time ago.

    Mayor Dory, it may not be one thing that turns things around, but i can think of ONE major thing which would get things going in the right direction - FIRE ROD.

    -- Posted by hometownboy on Wed, Nov 14, 2018, at 8:33 AM
  • Here's an idea, extend the hours of operation passed 7 or 8 PM (whatever it's been). Most of us working parents don't get off work until 5 PM or later. It doesn't make sense to round the kids up for an evening at the pool when we only get a 2 hour period to swim. I'm not wasting $20-$30 on a couple hours. If prices go up, I'll probably make the 30 minute trip to Plainfield so my kids can get a full experience. Week night swims will be completely out of the question too. And I'm willing to bet several other parents have the same attitude.

    And putting in a $2 million lazy river sounds nice, but how much will admission go up at that point? How can you expect a turn around off that? It may bring more people in, but for how long before it becomes another boring attraction?

    I also agree with hometown boy, leave the pool open through labor day. Schedule in advance to work around your staff's sports schedules. Provide incentives for them to work. Or find staff who aren't involved in fall sports.

    -- Posted by momof2ingreencastle on Wed, Nov 14, 2018, at 11:45 AM
  • Unless you are going to sink millions of dollars into that park and the pool it will not gain more people. Times have changed and the pool is boring. Maintaining and keeping the diving board would have helped. Extended hours, lazy river and speed slide would also help but it would not become a "destination point" as Linda Dunbar stated and there is nothing downtown to attract them to come there either. I agree with everyone else that the park director needs to go. That should be the first step!

    -- Posted by putnamcountyproud on Wed, Nov 14, 2018, at 12:33 PM
  • Suggestions:

    1. Bring back a 1-meter diving board.

    2. Ask groups (businesses in Putnam County(Heartland, Ascena, Crown, Phoenix, etc.), civic groups like the Elks, Moose, American Legion, VFW, Rotary, Kiwanis, Cloverdale Lions Club, Banks - PNC, Old Nat'l, North Salem St., Teachers Credit Union, etc. to sponsor a day or evening of swimming.

    3. Don't rely on just high school young people to lifeguard. Seek anyone over 18 to lifeguard. This could extend the season to nearly October if the weather cooperated.

    4. Extend evening hours to 5-9PM.

    5. Provide tower heaters for night time swimming where one could warm up after getting out of the pool.

    -- Posted by Lookout on Wed, Nov 14, 2018, at 2:16 PM
  • Stop “Family Swim” time at 5pm and let the kids stay. I’m sure the teenagers are wanting to swim longer but they have to leave if they are not there with an adult.

    I don’t understand why Greencastle can’t team up with DePauw to hire lifeguards. The swim coach for DPU is on the bored so why not include DPU swimmers (or non swimmers) to work after Putnam County Schools return class in early August?

    I agree that a Lazy River would be nice, but interest would be quickly lost within a few summers.

    I don’t think the Splash Park has had too much affect on attendance. As for raising the daily admission, you’re absolutley crazy to think families or groups will pay more than $5.00 per person.

    I take my family to Lieber. Yes, there’s a gate fee but it’s cheaper to pay the gate fee plus their admission price than to go out our city pool.

    -- Posted by bcqmom on Wed, Nov 14, 2018, at 10:13 PM
  • Perhaps a New Director is in order?

    -- Posted by rosecroixindy on Thu, Nov 15, 2018, at 8:07 AM
  • Why are you limiting life guards to kids? Why not hire retirees (who have passed the training) to life guard once school is back in session. Who do you think other communities higher once school is in session

    -- Posted by ridge6641 on Thu, Nov 15, 2018, at 11:54 AM
  • I have read the submissions already printed and if I might add, “Right now, looking at our five-year master plan, what I’d like to see down the road would be a lazy river. But that’s $2 million as an estimate from Spear Corp.” As we are already losing money at the current rates, HOW will throwing ANOTHER $2 million dollars at the problem help? Like throwing more millions at the failing school Common Core Program? I admit that the extended hours of operation, like 9:00am to 8:00pm and open in May and closing in September, would generate more service hours and weeks, but do we need a snack bar? And mature swimmers for Life Guards are available all around us, some are College Kids, some are retirees. Splash park was a cute add-on, but cost way more than it should have and now without the room to add it into the current system one of the people in charge of throwing our taxes into the fire says he wants a Lazy River added, too. I hate to upset your reality, but Lower the family price or the daily price and bring in More customers that way. How much will you charge if you build a $2 million dollar Lazy River? You will only have to move the pool into the middle of the baseball field, so the river will have the room to flow around it. No other way to accomplish the ridiculous but to rip up the older areas. Sorry about making you look at the unintended future results of your folly, but the actual cost will be greatly larger than your predictions, as we have seen with every project this city government has wasted our money on, over the years.

    -- Posted by alfr1 on Thu, Nov 15, 2018, at 1:10 PM
  • Get rid of the pool.

    And the director.

    -- Posted by AverageWhiteGuy on Thu, Nov 15, 2018, at 2:28 PM
  • Cost is already expensive for what the pool offers. We drive to leiber and pay less. Kids have more fun there, they can use the slide with an adult. No height requirement. That in itself is worth the drive. They love it. Plus the pool closes so many days for swim meets, private parties, etc. We stopped buying a family pass because we missed out on so many days. Sinking more money in wont help. It will raise cost even more and wont be worth it in my opinion. The rules also changed for family passes. Grandparents were once able to buy a family pass that included people from multiple households, we were told that was no longer possible. It has gone down hill on so many levels.

    -- Posted by hometowngirl626 on Fri, Nov 16, 2018, at 8:56 AM
  • Put in real terms and assuming that the park/ city has to only pay for 1/2 of the lazy river.

    At $5 per person, 200,000 people would need to break even on the building costs. 400,000 if pay for all.

    That doesn't include the other expenses in maintaining the river.

    Looks like thoughts and feelings might be ruling over economics.

    -- Posted by beg on Fri, Nov 16, 2018, at 12:13 PM
  • Although $5 is not an unreasonable admission price, it starts to become that when you consider there is a 10-15 minute rest break every hour. Rest breaks are not required, nor even recommended by state or local ordinances. Most pools that do have rest breaks take only one at the mid point of the afternoon.

    Also, I don’t have a horse in this race (rarely use park facilities), but I am curious as to why all of the bad feelings towards the parks director. If he really is not doing his job, the mayor and/or city council should be addressing it.

    -- Posted by 3m50 on Fri, Nov 16, 2018, at 12:51 PM
  • Just saw a posting on Facebook that the roof on the new bandshell is on the verge of being ruined because it has not yet been shingled. Looking for an explanation from city council, Steve Fields or Adam Cohen or Mayor Dory. Inexcusable! Donors should be irate! Maybe the complaints about the park director are justified?

    -- Posted by 3m50 on Sat, Nov 17, 2018, at 3:03 PM
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