Council ponders tying 2022 city bonuses to being vaccinated

Monday, September 13, 2021
Adam Cohen

With news that less than 50 percent of City of Greencastle employees have been vaccinated against COVID-19, a move to tie their potential bonuses to being vaccinated was suggested at the September City Council meeting at City Hall.

With the city salary ordinance (2021-12) up for first reading, City Clerk-Treasurer Lynda Dunbar announced that salaried city workers would receive a 1.9 percent increase in pay next year, while hourly workers will get a 1.8 percent pay hike for 2022.

In addition, if the ability to pay for annual bonuses is determined by the City Council, fulltime employees could receive up to $1,000 at the end of 2022.

“We’ve been pretty frugal this year,” Dunbar noted, “and also our insurance is much lower than what we thought it was going to be. So we felt we had some extra money we could do bonuses to go along with our consultants (telling us) to give people a little extra because we had a little extra.”

That’s when Councilman Adam Cohen suggested the tie-in with COVID vaccinations.

“I’d like to introduce an idea,” Cohen said. “I’m not making this a motion because I don’t know yet if it’s within the realm of state law.

“But I firmly believe in vaccinations,” the councilor continued. “I believe if you look at the statistics, they keep people out of the hospital. They keep our employees at work, and I’d like to suggest that next month, once we check the legalities of it all, diverting the bonus money to an incentive program for our employees who would be vaccinated by a set date in the future.”

Cohen said other cities have invoked such incentives.

“The stats are pretty clear,” he said, “in terms of avoiding hospitalization. It also has a huge impact economically because if you are vaccinated and you are exposed, you do not quarantine. You’re asked to mask up but you can go to work. But if you are not vaccinated, then you don’t go to work and that can create hardships.”

Other City Council members had comments.

First, Cody Eckert said he wanted to get City Attorney Laurie Hardwick’s input on the matter. She was absent Thursday night.

Meanwhile, Veronica Pejril said she was “generally warm” to the notion.

“The devil is in the details,” Councilman Dave Murray responded. “There’s so much misinformation on this right now. We have city employees who can’t come to work because of it. It’s not fair to the public. It’s not fair to people in City Hall.”

Cohen agreed.

“It’s not fair to fellow employees who get called in,” he added. “It also costs us money if they’re working OT (overtime).”

“Our bench is not deep when it comes to city employees, to use a coaching term,” Pejril interjected.

Council member Stacie Langdon then asked how many city employees have been vaccinated.

Clerk-Treasurer Dunbar said the city’s insurance provider was giving employees $50 to get vaccinated.

The last information received, Dunbar said, indicated the city was not yet at 50 percent.

“So we opened it back up and we increased it by three,” Dunbar said. “We did a hard stop date on July 1 and we were disappointed that we were not at 50 percent, so we opened it back up and got three more employees vaccinated.”

Mayor Bill Dory noted that several emails were sent out, encouraging employees to get vaccinated and giving dates of vaccination clinics in the area.

“We tried everything to try to encourage them,” Dunbar noted.

The mayor said city employees will have to use sick time and vacation time to cover quarantines.

“If you’re laid up for 14 days, that chews through a lot of sick time,” Dory said.

“That chews through a lot of overtime,” Cohen responded, “as we try to cover that shift too.”

No formal motion was made to amend the ordinance to include vaccination mandates for bonuses for city employees.

As written the motion passed unanimously on first reading on a motion from Council President Mark Hammer.

The next regular session of the City Council is set for 7 p.m. Thursday, Oct. 14 at City Hall.

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  • *

    1) I am not surprised by this, or who supports it. Tying a bonus to whether or not you wish to be part of an experiment? That is just sick thinking.

    2) Why are excess taxes being paid as bonuses? Simply wrong.

    3) "if you are vaccinated and you are exposed, you do not quarantine. You’re asked to mask up but you can go to work. But if you are not vaccinated, then you don’t go to work"... WHAT?!?!?!

    We know that if you are vaccinated you can still get AND SPREAD the virus.

    So how is it that simple exposure (to use his word), presumably without symptom (otherwise you stay home regardless of notavax status), gets one group quarantined and the other simply asked to wear a mask?

    This goes against all logic. (But, City Council...)

    Stupid or evil... take your pick.

    -- Posted by dreadpirateroberts on Mon, Sep 13, 2021, at 10:47 PM
  • DPR-"Tying a bonus to whether or not you wish to be part of an experiment? That is just sick thinking."

    Well said! Perfect.

    DPR-"Stupid or evil... take your pick."

    Again , total agreement.

    -- Posted by Prince of Stardust Hills on Mon, Sep 13, 2021, at 11:01 PM
  • If you read carefully, it is not about health, but economics. What is sickening is to cloak it as health.

    I am vaccinated and believe in it but the NSLLP theology is amazing.

    Well, they do believe in personal medical choices in some cases, no matter who it may hurt.

    -- Posted by beg on Mon, Sep 13, 2021, at 11:26 PM
  • Not a fan of requiring vaccines to work, or tying it to compensation.

    I would vote NO

    -- Posted by small town fan on Mon, Sep 13, 2021, at 11:55 PM
  • Calling the Covid vaccine an “experiment” while the other side of the mouth touts the usefulness of ivermectin is disingenuous, at best.

    -- Posted by Koios on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 6:20 AM
  • That didn’t last long.

    -- Posted by beg on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 7:00 AM
  • The vaccine is an experiment...just because one of them got FDA approval doesn't mean it works. We have evidence of that. Ivermectin - not even going to talk about that! I also have a problem with an exposed vaccinated person not being quarantined and allowed to work exposing everyone in the workplace. And finally, I don't believe the employees should be receiving a bonus especially if the bonus is tied to being vaccinated. Talk about discrimination for personal beliefs. No I am not currently vaccinated but I would get the shot if it was more thoroughly tested and yes I have had Covid.

    -- Posted by Homegrown765 on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 2:43 PM
  • Practical Sense!!!!

    -- Posted by beg on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 3:55 PM
  • *

    "doesn't mean it works. We have evidence of that."

    That's your definition of practical sense? Guess that clears a few things up :)

    A bonus being tied to something isn't discrimination. Look up the definition of bonus.

    -- Posted by RSOTS on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 4:37 PM
  • Is this ever a dangerous & slippery slope to go down! Yes, it costs the city money when someone misses work because they have COVID and they need to be replaced with someone working overtime. The same thing applies to anyone with any type of illness. Let’s give bonuses to non-smokers, and those who live a healthy lifestyle by exercising and eating a healthy diet, maintaining a healthy weight, etc. Last I heard we were a free country, able to make our own medical decisions as well as having the right to medical privacy.

    I have been vaccinated and wish more would get vaccinated, but I support their right not to, as well as their right to the privacy of their medical decisions and records.

    -- Posted by 3m50 on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 5:31 PM
  • Absolutely uncalled for, I agree with 3m50. Give bonuses to those who do not smoke, after all smoking affects those around you too! It should be your choice if you want to get it or not!

    -- Posted by myjaylantt on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 6:29 PM
  • If there's "extra money" in the budget, return it to the taxpayer's! That "extra money" came out of their pockets!

    -- Posted by jake71 on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 6:56 PM
  • *

    Koios - I am calling the notavax an "experiment" b/c it IS an experiment currently being conducted.

    The only difference is all of society is the experiment.

    Those that take the shot (and that is their choice, I don't hate 'em for it) are the "experiment", and those that do not take the shot are now the control group.

    Its not a partisan thing. It's not an ideological thing.

    It is the simple fact that those who take the shot are being experimented on b/c the technology (mRNA) is fairly new to a point of workability without the benefit of long-term effects studies.

    It's science.

    -- Posted by dreadpirateroberts on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 8:41 PM
  • I think all that have been vaccinated (includes me) and also demand others to get vaccinated must sign over all rights to civil litigation and reward with no exceptions at time of vaccine or next medical appointment. They should also agree to all boosters as demanded by government and face penalty, including jail time if they skip the booster.

    Those on here promoting vaccines- agree or disagree? I excitedly await your response. So you know, I would sign that document. Of course, easy to say since I don't have to.

    -- Posted by beg on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 8:58 PM
  • jake71,

    You have a misunderstanding. The NSLLP and their congregants considers your money their money.

    -- Posted by beg on Tue, Sep 14, 2021, at 9:08 PM
  • beg, you're like a Dollar General DPR. At least DPR, even though I dont agree with most of what they say, makes clear their stance and opinions. You are all over the place, from fantasy land to hyperbole to this extremely weird obession with NSLLP.

    -- Posted by BJCP96 on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 10:01 AM
  • Playbook!

    -- Posted by beg on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 3:13 PM
  • *

    Aren't bonuses, by definition, discretionary pay that workers shouldn't ordinarily expect?

    Also, what is a NSLLP? Is it a secret club to which I've not yet learned the handshake?

    -- Posted by Bunny1E on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 3:18 PM
  • Some nutty thing that beg dreamed up. I think the two LL's are Liberal/Leftist? And the S is Socialist? The N and P are a mystery. Basically its a fake Boogieman that keeps beg up at night.

    -- Posted by BJCP96 on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 3:26 PM
  • Of course it could mean THE NATIONAL STUDY OF LIVING-LEARNING PROGRAMS (NSLLP), thats the only thing the interwebs pulled up.

    -- Posted by BJCP96 on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 3:27 PM
  • *

    I believe that Beg is referring to the "National Scooter Loving Lunkers Patrol".

    -- Posted by RSOTS on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 3:53 PM
  • To all Greencastle City employees that are not vaccinated,

    there are plenty of job openings with businesses that value your choice to be in control of your health!

    Do not let the Bribery and Coercion techniques of your City Council force you to get vaccinated if you choose not to!

    I am so disappointed that in this day in age your City Council would discriminate against you getting a bonus based on your vaccination status. If they do reduce your bonus because of this I would find an attorney and sue!

    I would make my voice heard!

    What happens when the "vaccinated employee" gets covid will they then be exempt from the bonus? They will be using sick days, other employees will have to fill in.

    You are in control of your Health. Do not let the lure of $$ trick you into sacrificing your overall health.

    Vaccines take 2-15 years to be developed, Research and Discovery, Pre Clinical Animal Studies, Clinical Human Trials in 4 phases.

    Do your research.

    -- Posted by jmack46120 on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 4:17 PM
  • Why does every person that doesnt know what they are talking about end with "Do your research."? Facebook is NOT research.

    -- Posted by BJCP96 on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 4:20 PM
  • Playbook

    -- Posted by beg on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 4:22 PM
  • NSSLP = "New Spicy Salsa Lovers Party"?

    Is beg just trying to drum up attendee's for their Salsa Party? I'd probably come, I enjoy a nice picante sauce from time to time.

    Do your research.

    -- Posted by BJCP96 on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 4:28 PM
  • *

    The Amateur Epidemiology Society's crack team of dedicated internet researchers are hard at work and adjusting their tinfoil helmets for optimal confirmation-bias!

    If you've chosen to value the voices of cable TV commentators and questionably-named Facebook groups over the voices of scientific expertise (which necessarily evolve as as the virus mutates), you can go to the back of my line. Your liberty to choose to be unvaccinated doesn't trump my right to be safe from your unvaccinated lung-exhaust.

    -- Posted by Bunny1E on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 4:33 PM
  • BJCP96 Why do you assume that everyone gets their info from Facebook? Is that where you get yours?

    Just like an elitist to think others aren't smart enough to be knowledgeable.

    It is exhausting reading all the comments from "you so called know it alls" The same folks comment on everything. You keep living in your CNN bubble and leave the rest of us that actually research and educate ourselves alone.

    -- Posted by jmack46120 on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 4:33 PM
  • *

    "This study demonstrated that natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalization caused by the Delta variant of SARS-CoV-2, compared to the BNT162b2 two-dose vaccine-induced immunity. Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant."

    https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1

    Natural immunity is better than two-dose shot immunity but not as good as natural immunity COMBINED WITH a single-dose (presumably) of the two-dose.

    For you to consider:

    This is from Israel, one of the most "vaccinated" nations in the world.

    The study is "Delta variant" specific and Pfizer two-dose shot specific.

    Also this study has not been peer-reviewed yet.

    No spin. Just a pending SCIENTIFIC study that you likely won't see on the news, and the alternative media will turn it into something more than it is while ignoring the last part about the combination being most effective.

    Do your own research.

    -- Posted by dreadpirateroberts on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 6:59 PM
  • Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory, who publishes these manuscripts at medrxiv.org states the following on their website:

    “Such manuscripts have yet to undergo peer review and should be considered as preliminary status and the manuscripts should not be considered for clinical application, nor relied upon for news reporting as established information.”

    Which may be why you are not seeing this on the news. From the information released as of yet, you can’t even see much of the methodology used and no sample sizes are reported. Grain of salt, at least for now.

    I did my research.

    -- Posted by Koios on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 7:41 PM
  • Koios,

    Your position should be the way it is. Sadly, lack of information hasn't stopped stories getting placed on the news.

    I don't see it getting fixed as ratings are either the 1A or 1B goal of 99% of all news companies- print, audio, or visual.

    I do enjoy the above conversation you had with DPR. Same for the other article regarding representation- focused on an issue, a couple of solutions offered, agreement found on some level, no partisan pulpit used, and an arena of ideas created for someone to ponder!

    thanks

    -- Posted by beg on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 9:46 PM
  • Beg, you are welcome.

    -- Posted by Koios on Wed, Sep 15, 2021, at 10:06 PM
  • Why are the salaried employees (generally paid more than hourly) receiving a higher pay increase than the hourly workers?

    -- Posted by greencastleparent on Thu, Sep 16, 2021, at 9:27 AM
  • Is Cohen going after the unvaccinated today and then maybe those with previously disclosed medical conditions, the older workers, the smokers, the pregnant, the underweight, the overweight, and the obese tomorrow? They may all require far more sick days than average. What about those with natural immunities; where will they fit into his plan?

    Seems like a dangerously slippery slope and possibly an example of shallow thinking even as a mere suggestion. I hope smarter minds give this idea a very careful review because, as someone in the article commented, the devil is in the details.

    And yes, I've been vaccinated while still believing in freedom and personal choice.

    -- Posted by Prince of Stardust Hills on Thu, Sep 16, 2021, at 2:20 PM
  • *

    Koios - LOL. I fully disclosed that this was not peer-reviewed. I was pretty explicit in what it was and offered it as a rebuttal to the idea that anyone concerned about the notavax is some fox-news watching, Trump idolator stocked up on tinfoil and ivermectin out searching the web for confirmation bias from alternative media.

    Its a study. Data. Add it to the pile.

    Shoot, we have Nicki Minaj (not exactly a darling of the right)... and y'all have Trump (the Man himself). LOL.

    Strange bedfellows, indeed.

    -- Posted by dreadpirateroberts on Thu, Sep 16, 2021, at 7:38 PM
  • Agree with Prince. This idea is very shallow thinking, at best. It’s scary to think that the leaders of our city would even consider such an idea and not one council member had a strong reaction against it. Councilman Cohen suggested it as an idea, not a proposal because he didn’t know whether it was legal or not, but then went on to say that other communities have instituted similar measures. I’d like to have Councilman Cohen give us a list of those communities.

    -- Posted by 3m50 on Fri, Sep 17, 2021, at 10:19 AM
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