Downtown disarray disgusts Councilman Dave Murray

Monday, May 16, 2022
Dave Murray

It’s not often you catch Greencastle City Councilman Dave Murray angry. But he certainly was at the May meeting of the City Council.

“I’m going to be a little overly dramatic here,” Murray warned as his turn for Council reports began. “Greencastle is no longer an All-America City and it’s no longer a Stellar Community.”

That had to hurt him to say. Murray was part of committee that helped earn the All-America City designation in 1991, and his wife, Sue Murray, spearheaded the Stellar Community designation as mayor during the 2011 announcement of that state honor.

Sharing a pair of photographs with fellow councilmen, Murray said he was embarrassed last week when he spotted “dog poop” on the sidewalk in front of Scoops Ice Cream on South Indiana Street with nearby trash cans overflowing with refuse.

“It’s so embarrassing, you can tell I’m pissed,” he continued. “Tens of millions of dollars have been invested there. The (DePauw University) trustees -- some of them who’ve invested millions of dollars in Greencastle -- had to walk right by there today on their way to a wine-tasting event at the new wine merchant.”

Murray said he had been unable to get ahold of the proper person at the Street Department but planned on asking for “a sweep of the downtown.” He said the downtown then should be monitored for trash and other problems every other day by someone in the Street Department.

“It’s gotten old,” Murray added. “I can’t tell you how many downtown merchants have cornered me to say ‘something’s got to be done’ to clean up the downtown.”

Murray said he would use what remaining funds he has in his individual Council budget -- all seven councilors were given $8,000 or $9,000 this year to use for projects within their wards or of special interest to them -- to hire someone to clean up the downtown.

“That’s all I’m going to say for tonight,” Murray added, “you can tell I’m pissed.”

Mayor Bill Dory tried to ease his mind, saying, “Dave, I want to assure you we’re working on it.”

That only fired him back up.

“You’re not working on it, Bill, or it would be done.”

“Come see me tomorrow,” Dory suggested.

“I don’t need to talk to you, Bill,” Murray replied. “You just need to do something about it. The downtown is filthy.”

Meanwhile, in the only old business addressed by the Council Thursday night, Ordinance 2022-2 was adopted unanimously on second reading.

The ordinance amends the city salary ordinance to provide for salary increases for pool lifeguards and sets the base pay of $1,500 for the park softball director.

Lifeguards will now be paid at $15 an hour for the head guard, $12 per hour for returning lifeguards and $11 an hour for first-time guards.

The pay increases seems to have helped in getting enough guards for the coming season with 22 or 23 guards in the fold for this summer, “a good number to have, according to my aquatics director,” new City Park Director Greg Ruark noted, adding that the guards have already had two training sessions at City Hall.

Ruark was asked by Councilor Veronica Pejril if the pool repainting had gotten done as planned. It has, Ruark said, noting that it took less than the anticipated two days to do so.

“The pool’s coming along,” Ruark said. “We’re taking a number of questions about it on a daily basis.”

Among those are undoubtedly questions about when the pool will open. The repainting of a section of the pool looked to keep it from opening on time, but now Ruark isn’t so sure.

“It’s going to be really close as possible for Memorial Day,” he said. “If not Memorial Day, it’s likely to be the day after.”

The splashpark opening also nears as water tests for both it and the aquatic center are being prepared for examination at a Seymour facility, Ruark said.

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  • I am fine with a city employee doing rounds and cleaning when needed, but do have one question.

    If business owners and others are complaining, I would have to ask,

    Can you not check and occasionally clean up in front of your own business or office?

    I have to pick up at my house, and place of business, good exercise to walk and bend occasionally, and protective gloves are sold everywhere since Covid.

    Curious if anyone else has this question also.

    -- Posted by small town fan on Mon, May 16, 2022, at 6:37 PM
  • Now that is absolutely disgusting! Imagine, being a millionaire who took precious time to come to Greencastle from your gated community, to visit the campus where you've made large donations to, and while walking down the public sidewalk you (gasp) see dog feces on the ground, next to a full trash can in front of an ice cream store (where the commoners frequent) during the hot summer days! How will you ever be able to enjoy your fine wine tasting plans after seeing that? Where are the maids and landscapers, and why aren't they fired yet? This pish posh calls for public condemnation and angry cursing! pish posh, I say!

    -- Posted by Raker on Mon, May 16, 2022, at 7:51 PM
  • Well said and holding ground against the Mayor. Thank you Mr Murray

    -- Posted by marigold28 on Mon, May 16, 2022, at 8:09 PM
  • I too would like to add my support to Mr. Murray's comments. I am a dog owner and walk all over town, the Sports Park and the DePauw Nature Park. It is rare when I don't see dog poop on the sidewalks in town and or on the trails and paths. I always pick up after my dog so I know what this entails. I can only assume it is out of ignorance or laziness that people don't do the same.

    While addressing the condition of downtown, I wonder why the owners at 22 and 24 West Washington don't take care of the appearance of these buildings. Trash and leaves populate the entrance to the buildings; the windows are really dirty; and the insides seem to be full of junk. This is the greeting for anybody coming into or through town from the north as they pass through the courthouse square.

    -- Posted by Shoelace on Mon, May 16, 2022, at 8:31 PM
  • This peeves me off so much, the city really needs to hire someone whose job is patrolling downtown picking up trash and dog poop, so that the local elite business class can feel comfortable walking between restaurants and wine tastings. So angry about this...

    -- Posted by Raker on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 7:21 AM
  • The south side of the square is a disaster. If you are at the stop light where 231 turn north and look south it is horrible. If you are someone unfamiliar with Greencastle your first impression would be, "Awe this town must be dying". They don't drive around the square to see the thriving town, only the one with black moss or whatever on a awning, trash in the doorways, litter around the streets. Greencastle needs a good spring cleaning no matter if you are going for ice cream, wine or just a walk. We need to be proud of our city.

    -- Posted by whatruthinking2 on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 7:22 AM
  • I applaude Mr. Murray and yet he doesn't go far enough. The dog situation is all over Greencastle. Walking around the neighborhood or People's Pathway there is dog poop left for others to step around (or in). I recently mention to a lady she needed to pick up after her dog (People's Pathway) and she suggested I take a trip to an extremely hot place.

    -- Posted by Workingthesoil on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 8:01 AM
  • I totally get what you're saying it really ****** me off, too. It's like when I go in someone's home for the first time, if it doesn't look like I just walked into a bed and breakfast I immediately feel contempt for them and I'm like "oh... I'm better than you, you're just a low class poor" and then I get super ****** off.

    -- Posted by Raker on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 8:13 AM
  • Raker,

    We commoners need to make sure our town is PERFECT for those who have so graciously given us their money....I mean, "they" own this town, right? Or are getting close to it, each time they add a new business. You are absolutely right, and we MUST be more vigilant in making sure the town looks like no one lives here. We don't want to disappoint the money...

    -- Posted by anymouse on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 8:35 AM
  • I think we should have an annual Greencastle Spring Cleaning day. We could sign up for an area, grab a bag, and clean it up. The city could offer an area of town for folks to bring their old stuff laying around too so that it can be recycled. Seems like they do that in Cloverdale/Stardust maybe. We should be proud of our town for us and for those that stop by to visit. I think the city should have the street department scanning a different area of town everyday looking to clean up. That is what they get paid for. The Mayor is in charge of the town and that is where it has to start. Thank you Mr. Murray for bringing this up.

    -- Posted by localjoe on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 9:07 AM
  • Sorry anymouse, you lost me a little bit. But if your saying that the city is to blame and business or property owners have no responsibility to maintain the appearance in front of their building, I totally agree. We need to make life as easy as possible for these saints who bless us with jobs and businesses to shop.

    -- Posted by Raker on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 9:11 AM
  • "I want to assure you we’re working on it.” - Seems I've seen SitComs that use this line often.

    -- Posted by Workingthesoil on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 9:23 AM
  • “Tens of millions of dollars have been invested there. The (DePauw University) trustees -- some of them who’ve invested millions of dollars in Greencastle -- had to walk right by there today on their way to a wine-tasting event at the new wine merchant.”

    This says it all, right there.

    -- Posted by Koios on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 9:28 AM
  • Some Dave Murray fans in here? Bottom line what I'm getting at, I don't like the way he handled it. I generally think managers who yell and lose their temper over little things aren't really that good at their job. That's been my experience. Completely unnecessary. Just creating resentment that won't be forgotten anytime soon. He said he thinks the trash has been a problem for a long time, but never once tried to address it prior? Gee, if only he knew someone in a position to take action. Oh, he said he tried but couldn't reach them. It sounds disingenuous on the surface. Then the show of anger I suppose to show he's serious because he was embarrassed in front of the donors, is he seriously afraid they'll quit donating because of a full trash can and a turd? I personally don't care about any of these rich snobs, and could never have a job kowtowing for them.

    And I really would like to see these pictures, unless some raccoons got in there and scattered it or something then I don't get it. Of all the ways to handle it he chose this. I personally don't like it. That management style is becoming less and less tolerated. And you guys are tripping about downtown looking terrible, you just want everything to look phony and perfect all the time, seriously!

    -- Posted by Raker on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 11:36 AM
  • All that being said, it's a minor issue to me. I don't really see him as some bad guy so I'd probably still vote for him.

    -- Posted by Raker on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 12:07 PM
  • Raker, I was being sarcastic. I was agreeing with you. In the most sarcastic way possible.

    -- Posted by anymouse on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 12:23 PM
  • The point I was trying to make, but maybe not very well, is that we should want the city to be clean for it's residents. Not for some big wigs throwing around their money. If they've got so much of it, they can pay to have to it cleaned up. This is about having a beautiful town for US to enjoy.

    -- Posted by anymouse on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 12:30 PM
  • Got it anymouse, I totally agree

    -- Posted by Raker on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 12:39 PM
  • Is there a better example of a core government service than providing roads and sidewalks for the common good? Is it too much to ask the government to tend to their roads and sidewalks?

    If it were up to me, the curmudgeon, I’d prefer not to give up a portion of my property for a right-of-way and a sidewalk. Doing so just makes it easier for some of you, or your dogs, to poop wherever you please.

    And **** the property owners. We should all want to live in a town where my poop is someone else’s problem.

    -- Posted by The Crusty Curmudgeon on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 12:46 PM
  • Thankfully the "Importants" were walking around the square, and not driving around Greencastle, or they may have also noticed the ridiculous sized potholes and the half-assed attempt to "fix" them.

    This should be what really makes the town council mad...

    -- Posted by anymouse on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 1:04 PM
  • US 231 , aka Bloomington St, E. Washington St and N. Jackson St., are INDOT's responsibility. With that said, I do agree that the condition of these roads is an embarrassment for the city, but we are at the mercy of INDOT. Thankfully, Bloomington St. is being rebuilt this summer and fall, and next year the rest of US 231 will be done.

    -- Posted by gustave&zelma on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 1:09 PM
  • Those roads are particularly bad, but have you just drove around Greencastle lately?? There is not a good road in town. They all need major repairs. This is not just an INDOT issue, this is a city issue as well, and we should be embarrassed about it also.

    -- Posted by anymouse on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 1:31 PM
  • Moss growing in the bricks on the sidewalks. Weeds growing around the cement planters and in the brick sections of the sidewalks. Too much mulch placed in the tree pits around the square and growth in that now. The mulch overflowing into the street and the sidewalks. Christmas decorations still in the cement planters in April. Streets dirty. Where is the street sweeping machine?? Sidewalk in front of the Banner Graphic bulging from tree root growth. Hazard to the public. Trees need trimmed or removed. These are not a businessperson's issue, but these issues are being brought out to come up with a solution... I agree... Greencastle is dirty and only so much a business owner can do to clean the whole downtown square.

    -- Posted by dumpsterdiva61 on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 2:05 PM
  • Quick, list the families that have done for Greencastle than the Murray’s.

    -- Posted by bornandraisedandlovethecastle on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 3:15 PM
  • “That’s all I’m going to say for tonight,” Murray added, “you can tell I’m ******.”

    Mayor Bill Dory tried to ease his mind, saying, “Dave, I want to assure you we’re working on it.”

    That only fired him back up.

    “You’re not working on it, Bill, or it would be done.”

    “Come see me tomorrow,” Dory suggested.

    “I don’t need to talk to you, Bill,” Murray replied. “You just need to do something about it. The downtown is filthy.”

    .......This whole conversation reminds me of the current administration in the White House. Someone has hurt feelings and vents about it but nobody has solutions to fix anything except to "just do something about it"....typical statement from politicians.

    -- Posted by infiremanemt on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 3:18 PM
  • I’m typing too fast - I want a list of the families that have done more for Greencastle than the Murray’s. I’m not saying a list can’t be made, but it’s not going to be a long list. I, for one, have a deep respect and appreciation for all they have done for their adopted hometown. I’d wager a paycheck it’s far more than all of you yahoos talking nonsense in these comments combined. Who’s going to start the list?

    -- Posted by bornandraisedandlovethecastle on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 3:24 PM
  • Bornandraised--

    Mike & Phyllis Rokicki

    Bill & Joy Marley

    Jinsie Bingham

    Joyce & Judson Green

    The Longden Family

    Bob & Ellen Sedlack

    Nancy Michael

    Mike Tzouanakis

    Dan TeGrotenhuis

    Bill Dory--Mayor and Development Center

    Bob Jedele

    Dick Shuck--Phil the Need

    Many others that have gone before us in our City's history

    How's that for a start??

    -- Posted by gustave&zelma on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 4:05 PM
  • Gee, I didn't make the wine tasting event because I was busy keeping my own property in tip top shape. All these hoity toity wealthy DePauw people have kids going to school here. They don't give a crap whether they litter, throw beer bottles on the ground and other trash they think they are too good to bother with. My advise to Dave Murray is put on your jeans and grab a broom.

    -- Posted by Queen53 on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 5:15 PM
  • Well, from a public service standpoint I’m not sure there is a mayor + city council couple on there. . . but I may very well be wrong about that. And that public service comes after Sues work at the hospital and Dave’s work at DePauw.

    The point remains, they have given an awful lot to this community and continue to do so. Up to and including telling the Mayor to do better.

    My reason for writing was to highlight their decades of work to improve our community and to push back on the folks that don’t contribute a thing to the community but jump at the chance to turn his comments about pride of place into rich vs poor.

    -- Posted by bornandraisedandlovethecastle on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 5:21 PM
  • Why would a business that is the source of an overflowing trash can not keep the trash can empty?

    -- Posted by bannerfan on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 6:52 PM
  • So was the pile say from a poodle or possibly a Great Dane? Maybe we can narrow it down that way and find out who was responsible for this atrocious act of disregard!!!! As for the overflowing trash can I applaud the locals for buying local! If they were buying elsewhere other towns trash cans would be overflowing!!

    -- Posted by Simplelife on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 7:58 PM
  • While visiting in Virginia they had a dog law. Every so often were poop bags available to anyone walking their dog downtown or on any trails. You cleaned up you own dogs poop or face a hefty fine. Everyone took it very seriously.

    -- Posted by Nit on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 8:24 PM
  • While we are at it, why don't we look at what visitors to Greencastle see when approaching from the North, South, and East, before even reaching the town square. Deplorable!!!

    -- Posted by FactswithoutBS on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 8:38 PM
  • @bornandraisedandlovethecastle I've never met Mr. Murray, all I know about him is what I read in the paper. He seems like a good councilman that's passionate about serving the community and DePauw, and I support him. It's really not that big of an issue.

    -- Posted by Raker on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 8:55 PM
  • @bridgessara4 You are absolutely right, they need to get that cleaned up right now! Who cares why it's been delayed, whether understaffed, covid or backlog of higher priority projects, it doesn't matter! They are obviously just lazy and need to be fired! Just get it done! Sure, there's no actual trash, and barely even a cigarette butt to be seen, but there are weeds here and there! Someone needs to pull those weeds! Did the mulch get kicked out by pedestrians or shoveled out during the snow season? Who cares! clean up that mulch! Trim those trees! It's disgusting! Someone should call the health department about this!

    -- Posted by Raker on Tue, May 17, 2022, at 9:10 PM
  • Just want to thank Eric for bringing us the news! You are the best, sir! Please, don't ever retire.

    -- Posted by letspulltogether on Wed, May 18, 2022, at 8:42 AM
  • The GRASP program used to have students clean up around town (particularly focusing on downtown area) as part of their community service.

    Is that program still around?

    As a former business owner in a downtown building, I always took responsibility in cleaning my area.

    Now the dog poo is just disgusting….Do better pet owners.

    -- Posted by kbmom on Wed, May 18, 2022, at 9:53 AM
  • If ya’ll don’t like it here..move to an area where you can get shot going to church or murdered at the grocery store! When was the last time you got mugged on the way to Moores Bar? Or got raped walking downtown to the farmers market? We live in a peaceful small town where a few bad apples fail to pick up after their dog, where our neighbors perception of clean is a little different than yours. It sure feels good to go into the Fairway restaurant and have Dean call you by name and thank you for stopping in. Our children can go to school, get a good education, all while feeling safe. The roads get a little tired because of all the employed truckers working hard everyday to support their families that live locally and support our pleasant small town. So again, if it’s not clean enough for you, you can sell your house in just a couple days and move to the wonderful world of the unknown. Like they say…don’t let the door hit your “butt” on the way out!

    -- Posted by localjoe on Wed, May 18, 2022, at 11:15 AM
  • Eric Bernsee is possibly an immortal who will long outlive us all. I wonder if he will eventually start turning into stone, the way Anne Rice described

    -- Posted by Raker on Wed, May 18, 2022, at 11:32 AM
  • This isn't a topic about rich vs poor exactly - it's about always having DePauw thrown in people's faces in this town (county?) - and I am a DePauw alum. I can understand why people push back when the "weight" of DePauw is thrown around like it is a "threat" or a "warning" that we must keep DePauw happy or they might move the University or something... It hasn't happened in 185 years, so give it a rest...

    -- Posted by infiremanemt on Wed, May 18, 2022, at 12:09 PM
  • Some just don't know how lucky we are. I use to live in michigan and worked in south bend, some evenings when it got dark earlier I drove thru downtown south bend and out past norte dame and would see HUGE sewer rats and it would stink. I was so relieved when i would get to state line. So things could be worse and Norte Dame is still there.

    -- Posted by oldschool68 on Wed, May 18, 2022, at 2:54 PM
  • ON, this lazy rainy day Ive enjoyed all your problems, do what I did 30 - 35 years ago take your kids and some of the neighbor kids Wayne Rhine donated apples, Lyndon and Cindy Pointdextors donated sandwhiches, Dairy Queen cokes, water to drink and we put the kids in back of pick up trucks (which is illegal today) and drove over CLOVERDALE and the kid jumped off and we picked up that trash (Dr Ernest gave me money to pay for trash to be hauled off. Less and Betty Brumett hauled it of CHEAP Eric Hayman gave us s treat when we were done the kids got their picture in Banner Graphic with lots of THANKS The CLOVERDALE KID did a lot of town clean up as we had a clean up day, Please remember there was

    several other people that donated to our clean up (but Im getting OLD and seem to forget somethings. Good Luck Greencastle being Born and raised in Cloverdale was lots of fun as we all had the best parents and no money Bless YOU all Vera Sutherlin Hughes Excuse my mistakes but had fun and hope you all took this the way I mean it love you

    -- Posted by tripro on Wed, May 18, 2022, at 3:25 PM
  • Was the turd really from a dog, or was it Amber Heard? We'll probably never know for sure, but it looked too big for a yorkie

    -- Posted by Raker on Wed, May 18, 2022, at 4:22 PM
  • I hope our city officials are offering PTSD treatments to those Depauw millionaires!

    -- Posted by agatha on Wed, May 18, 2022, at 7:12 PM
  • Agatha.....What a great idea. They need a reality check.

    -- Posted by Queen53 on Thu, May 19, 2022, at 4:17 PM
  • DPU should help is this effort the pinheads are mainly the only people I see walking around downtown, Like Depauw doesn’t have the funds..Truth Hurts

    -- Posted by iu.boog84 on Fri, May 20, 2022, at 6:29 AM
  • In defense of Councilman Murray, if you look at the list of people on Depauw's board of trustees, it's a pretty impressive bunch of CEO's and company presidents from all over the country, including some really big companies like General Mills and Keybank. And millions of dollars in donations can do a lot of good things. So I understand him being upset.

    -- Posted by Raker on Fri, May 20, 2022, at 12:41 PM
  • If a business had trash from their business overflowing onto the sidewalks shouldn't the responsibility for cleaning it up be that business and not the cities?

    As for the dog poop, yes this is a problem all over the city. Especially at Robe Ann park. Thank you to the people who use the Dog park area at Big Walnut sports park. It is kept clean. Bags are brought to the dog park by the people who bring their dogs. My dogs go most days and it is rare that I find others poop. The biggest thank you goes out to the park associates who work hard to mow and pick up trash at all the city parks. The city associates do a terrific job with the amount of ground they need to cover.

    -- Posted by hop7363 on Sun, May 22, 2022, at 4:19 PM
  • Worked at both the City Pool and Bright Futures in high school. Last thing someone did every night before closing was to walk the outside of the business and pick up any trash and dispose of in the dumpsters. Not sure why this is a problem that needs the city to address instead of the local businesses.

    -- Posted by hometownboy on Tue, May 24, 2022, at 3:14 PM
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